Every so often, I'll say something negative about medicine, and I get a comment along the lines of:
Remember that you're lucky to even have an education and be able to earn a good living. This is a privileged discussion.
These comments kind of remind me of when you're a kid and your mom plops down some disgusting food like brussel sprouts in front of you, and you don't want to eat it, and she's like, "Other kids don't have food! You're lucky to have food! Would you rather live in [insert name of third world country]?"
No, I wouldn't. But that doesn't change the fact that brussel sprouts taste like crap.
If you go to a restaurant and the food you ordered doesn't taste good, are you not allowed to complain because other people don't have money for food? If the heat goes out in your house in the dead of winter, are you not allowed to complain because at least you have a home?
Are there good things about being in medicine? Yeah, of course. Is it absolutely always wonderful? Of course not. Are there aggravations, as there are in any job? Uh, yeah. Am I allowed to talk about these aggravations online without putting in a disclaimer each time? Last time I checked, I am.
Besides, you'll notice that the vast majority of my weekly whines are not about medicine.
When I feel down because of something related to medschool, people also like reminding me how privileged I am to be studying medicine and how many young people would give their front teeth to be in my position.
ReplyDeleteI get it. I'm lucky and some people aren't. But don't tell me they'd give their front teeth to be in an unpleasant condition, because they wouldn't.
Just like a starving child would probably eat brussel sprouts, not because it's nice but because he's hungry.
It seems like constantly on MiM we'll be having a serious discussion about some issue about being a working mom, and someone always HAS to break in and mention this.
DeleteWhen people say that to me my shameless reply is, "No, I'm not lucky. I worked my butt off and sacrificed a lot of things that may have been more fun/easier." Aside from those with a disability of any degree, there is always a reason (and surprise surprise, an excuse) why people don't get into med school.
DeleteYou're not lucky or unlucky. You worked your butt off and sacrificed a lot of things because you CHOSE to do so. Nobody forced you. If you hated it and were miserable , why not choose a different path? Different specialty? Etc.
DeleteIt seems to me it isn't a privilege to be there, it's something you've earned through hard work. I suppose you could count yourself lucky to have what it takes to make it into med school but once you're there it's something you worked hard to achieve and will have to continue to work hard to reach your goal. In my opinion you've earned the right to complain once in a while! (this is coming from someone who worked hard to get where I am in veterinary emergency medicine and I've earned the right to complain!)
ReplyDeleteIt comes down to the "we built it" chant from the RNC, which I think is bullshit. Some people do accomplish things based on nothing but their own intelligence and hard work. But I know that my parents gave me a lot of things that made it possible to get to where I am... if I had grown up in poverty, I likely wouldn't be a doctor. So in that sense, I likely am privileged. That said, I'm not sure why that means nobody has any right to complain.
DeleteI agree. It's like no one should ever complain about anything because there's always someone worse off. Just let everyone treat you like garbage.
ReplyDeleteExactly.
DeleteNot to mention those people who are trying to conceive who reprimand you for complaining about the trials of having children....
ReplyDeleteI feel like that's a tricky situation, because women who are having trouble conceiving are particularly sensitive about it. I saw my mom go through it and she'd literally cry when she found out someone at work was pregnant.
DeleteThat said, if you're complaining about your kids on the internet or facebook, they don't have the right to yell at you because if they don't like hearing that stuff, why are they reading??
^very well put
DeleteExactly. Obviously if I have a friend in real life who is having trouble conceiving, I won't go around complaining about my kids to her. But yeah, internet or facebook? If reading these things upsets you, then don't read them.
DeleteYou don't like it because whenever someone does that, you're presented with the thought that, huh, maybe you don't have it as bad as you think you do. And, that annoys you because that's not the response you want. The response you want is pity and for someone to say "awww, you do have it rough and I feel for you".
ReplyDeleteSometimes, people say things like that to make you feel better and make you realize that your problems are not as huge as you think they are and that other people have it worse. Instead of digging yourself a deeper hole, you should just take that into consideration and you'll feel better.
Unless you like other people pitying you for your "miserable" life.
I hope you don't take this the wrong way. From the blog, it does seem like there had some tough times, like when one of your classmates killed himself/herself. And, that is hard to deal with. But, you always have to look at the bright side of things.
On the other hand, if you whine about stuff kind of for the mere sarcasm or in a Jerry Seinfeld style, then that's entertaining and appreciated. But, obviously, this post isn't of that caliber.
Well, there have been conversations, for example, on Mothers in Medicine, where we've been discussing how frustrating it is that we don't get to see our kids as much as we like, or when our child is ill, it is nearly impossible to call in sick. Are these the absolute worst problems there are? No. But they're very common issues that women in medicine have, and I think we have a right to discuss it without adding a disclaimer at the end saying, "This is a privileged problem because we're not living in a dumpster and starving to death."
DeleteFor the record, I definitely do not want pity when I complain about medicine. When I write these posts, it's either to for empathy ("it's just like that for me too"), advice ("when my kids are sick, I do this.."), encouragement ("it's easier when they're older because..."), or to warn others ("I don't want that life so I'm not going to med school").
I see what you're saying. I guess it depends on the context of the whine.
DeleteI agree with you. If you're writing on Mothers in Medicine, known to be sort of like a support group for physician mothers, and you want some feedback, then it is unpleasant when someone says you can't complain. The whole point of Mothers in Medicine is so that you can get empathy, encouragement, advice,etc.
But, in general, it is good to keep in mind that we should be thankful for just the basics: roof over your head, stable job, kids, husband.
I wish there was a "Like" button for this comment.
DeleteIn general, people make that statement on Mothers in Medicine posts, which as you pointed out, is a supportive community.
DeleteI think a little before I wrote this, I received a few comments on this blog of the "don't whine because you're privileged" nature. For example, on this completely innocuous post that I didn't even think was complaining at all (http://doccartoon.blogspot.com/2012/07/tales-from-residency-like-forever.html), someone wrote:
"All you guys ever do is b*tch about medicine and how awful it is. What about the good parts of medicine? How about being thankful you even had an education to begin with? You wouldn't dare trade your places with anyone else that's for sure."
It was like a theme for a little while that people were asking me to write in every post just about how grateful I was to be in medicine.
Yes! This argument drives me mad but you see it everywhere. It used to drive me nuts in high school when people would get really ratty with me for being upset over not getting an A+ because they were "happy just to pass". If I know that I'm capable of something and have worked hard to achieve highly, I don't see why I shouldn't be allowed to be disappointed when I don't do as well as expected, even if there are plenty of other people achieving less.
ReplyDeleteI can see where they are coming from and, yes, it's good to keep things in perspective, but come on...
Oh booo hoooo...I didn't get an A+..
DeleteYeah seriously. There's a difference between being a doctor, which can negatively affect other parts of your life, and complaining that you didn't get an A+ in a course (which, let's be honest, is no comparison to not being able to raise your children, or overworking yourself into a depression). If you're in that range (A-ish) to begin with, then you're doing well in the course. There's no need to advertise that, because it comes across as rude and whiny.
DeleteI would say something like "Yeah I'm bummed out... I thought for the work I put in, the test would go better," and leave it at that.
It was never a matter of me complaining explicitly that I didn't get an A+, it was more along the lines of the comment you said, but apparently I wasn't allowed to be bummed out at all. People used to get annoyed at me just for seeming disappointed upon receiving my paper back. I would be annoyed at someone else if they walked around moaning loudly, "Oh man, I didn't get an A+" - yes, that is rude and whiny; no, that's not what I did.
DeleteAlso, I'm generally quite happy NOT to get extremely high marks but you can't make the generalisation that 'it doesn't matter' - if you want to get a scholarship or get into a competitive course like medicine, it matters a lot.
I read an article recently that relates very well to this issue:
ReplyDeletehttp://momastery.com/blog/2012/01/04/2011-lesson-2-dont-carpe-diem/
I so relate to this - when I'm tired after a long call, and having a moan, I will get someone saying in the background, 'Well, you chose this career.' (I am an OBGYN) Yes, I did, but it doesn't mean I am immune to normal human foibles like tiredness, grumpiness, PMS...
ReplyDeleteSo true. I think complaining is a human right.
DeleteYes, complaining is a human right, but it's also something that negative people who have had it easier than others tend to do.
DeleteIt's like the kids in class who complain that the teacher is being unfair when the teacher is only doing his/her job.
People who WANT to complain will always find something to complain about. It's all in your head. You can look at it in a positive light, or you can look at it in a negative light and wallow in thinking that your life is so unfair.
Life is unfair to everyone, so technically that makes it fair to all.
That's not a very good attitude, Anon. You're saying that anyone who complains is just being negative? So if while at your job, you complain that your boss is touching your body and making sexually inappropriate comments to you, then you're just a complainer who is just going to find something to complain about anyway?
DeletePeople complain for a lot of reasons. I think it's ridiculous to generalize like that. The reason I complain on here is mainly for entertainment purposes.
There's an exception to everything. Obviously a case of sexual harassment warrants the right to complain.
DeleteBut out of all the things you complain about, are most of them on that level, like the example of sexual harassment you just put forth? Probably not.
But if you do it mainly for entertainment purposes, then, hey, I love to be entertained.
I've also heard that if it's a legitimate complaint, it just sorts itself out in the end.
DeleteI get a lot of these comments from people in meds, but not as far through as we are. I honestly think they don't want to believe it CAN be that bad, because they are next lol.
ReplyDeleteThen, surprise surprise, when they get there, suddenly I speak gospel.
People not in medicine do not get it. They don't. Yes there are many wonderful things and I am the first to point that out. However, it doesn't make the ills go away. It doesn't change the fact that we are hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt, had to be in school three times longer than others, put off buying any major purchase until mid thirties, wait for children, never go on vacation, and that my husband works 100 hours a week for 8 bucks an hour. The average person would not be willing to do this. This speaks nothing of the emotional support needed, for both of us, that is draining and sometimes impossible to give.
But yes...those people are right. It is all rainbows and puppies.
I agree with your right to complain about the bad parts of medicine.
ReplyDeleteAnd Fizzy, I am not making the next comment about you, it's more of a general statement based on my experience with certain doctors. (Given what I have read on your blog, I can tell you are great with your patients, and NOT like the docs I am about to complain about).
What ticks me off as a patient is that I spent a lot of money to go to school too (OK, not $300K like a doctor, but quite a bit nonetheless), I work insane hours as a professional outside of medicine (sometimes 36+ hours in a row when emergencies arise), I have an awful boss, my clients are demanding and unappreciative, my personal life is extremely stressful just like everyone else's, and when my physicians ask me what I do, and how many hours I work, and I answer truthfully, they SCOWL at me and tell me they can't believe that that's my life. As if I am making it up and no one could possibly have as difficult a career or life as they do. Or they make flip remarks about how if it really and truly is that way for me, I should just drop the job and move on to something else. One even snidely told me "well, I know some so-and-so professionals like you, and they NEVER work past 5 pm." (which is like, wow. How does one have the nerve to say that? Would the doctor agree that that's the case in medicine? If one doctor works M-F 9 am to 5 pm, that means they all do?)
Newsflash: Especially in this day and age, when the economy is total crap, most people are in debt from attending college or graduate school, are working like dogs, have clients and bosses who treat them like sh*t, are delaying home purchasing and having kids, and all that other stuff, and they very often do not have the option of looking for another job, because there aren't very many out there right now. I still view myself as being pretty lucky, though, because I earn a respectable salary. There are so many others out there who work as hard as me, or harder, and make much less than I do.
I have a lot of respect for my doctors. I freely admit -- I couldn't do what they do. I just can't stand it when they act like they are the only ones with a tough gig.
Sorry, just had to vent a little!
Just like doctors don't have the monopoly on hard work, non-doctors don't have a monopoly on being insensitive idiots. When I was in med school, I told my PCP that I was feeling stressed out, and he said, "Why are you so stressed out? I found med school really easy."
DeleteI think everyone has a right to complain, especially on their blog.
Wow. I can't believe your PCP said that! I'd say that's more than just being an insensitive idiot -- that's arrogance personified.
DeleteThe beauty of this country is that you can and should say whatever the hell you want. So keep on keepin' on!
I love your weekly whines. The people who make the "privileged" comments are the people who are bitter about their own lives, or lack thereof. Besides, it's your blog..WHINE AWAY! lol :)
ReplyDeleteIf other people (who are worse off) are bitter about their lives, but you're the one complaining, then doesn't that make you even MORE bitter?? You are a doctor with a good income, and you are STILL complaining about your profession....seems to me like you'd be the one who is bitter...
DeleteMy friends and I call that ICBWing someone. ICBW - It Could Be Worse. Annoying as hell. Yes, someone always has it worse than someone else, but that does invalidate someone being frustrated by their own circumstances. Attempting to one-up their misery doesn't do any good at all.
ReplyDeleteI HATE the fact that I now have to add an almost perfunctory "I realize I am lucky to be here and am no way taking for granted my fortune" before saying anything bad about my day. I obviously am very well aware that I'm in a privileged position relative to the majority of other people in the world, and I don't need YOU, random guy jumping in to ICBW me, to remind me of that when I'm just trying to get some crap off my chest about my day. I completely second everyone who said that most of us didn't just miraculously drift down from the heavens, off of a Unicorn, and into medical school/residency/practice.
ReplyDeleteSo I get that none of us are complaining about oh, starving, and being without clean water, sure. But we're not exactly at the Louis CK-"How come I have to choose a language on this ATM machine!?" first world problems end of the spectrum either. This is not dichotomous, there is a middle ground. And in that middle lies, being mistreated, unappreciated, time away from your loved ones, missing your children grow up, and all of the not so great aspects that come along with being in medicine.
Believe it or not, complaining isn't just something who want to wallow in self-pity or emotionally manipulate other people do. It is, especially in this kind of a forum, a way for people who have shared similar experiences to feel a sense of solidarity, and community, and yeah, maybe allow ourselves to feel crappy for a night, so that we can go to bed tonight, and wake up tomorrow to live to fight another day.
So uh, shut up, Anon.